Trayvon Martin shooting: Zimmerman says Trayvon decked him, then began hammering him

[jeebus]

I get it man. I get it. My only problem is he murdered the guy with a gun. They could have fought it out like men. But Zimmerman couldn't take his ass whooping like a man. He got banged up, or so he says. That doesn't mean you kill the guy, imo.

I don't think there is any doubt he got banged up.

Maybe he should have taken is asz beating like a man, but the law says you don't have to be beaten.

 

[jeebus]

The police told him not to follow. And yeah, I think he lied about the threat as his defense of self-defense.

You should be able to appreciate that police are not always right, and fuck the police why should there word count for more than a man?

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

You should be able to appreciate that police are not always right, and fuck the police why should there word count for more than a man?

I want the guy to be innocent. I really do. I just don't believe he is. I misspoke. The police DISPATCHER told him not to follow him. They would be on the way. He did anyway. Was he going to rob someone while they were en route? I doubt he could and get away with that in the time it would've taken them to arrive. If he was suspicious and the police were on their way, why does he need to chase him?

I caught a guy crawling through my window in East Austin one time. I lived in an old house by an ally for a couple semesters while in school. Well, apparently, they thought the house was still empty and I met him at the window with a baseball bat and said you might want to think about what you're doing. He was startled and explained he didn't have a place to stay and was just looking for shelter. I probably should have called the cops, but I sorta felt for the guy and let him go. Could have whacked his head since he was on his way through my window... I just didn't feel like killing anyone. I bet Zimmerman wishes he would have thought a little before he went all anarchist on Trayvon.

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

I don't think there is any doubt he got banged up.

Maybe he should have taken is asz beating like a man, but the law says you don't have to be beaten.

There was a fight. But who started it? You walk through a neighborhood at night and a large mexican confronts you, are you just going to hang around and let him do whatever he wants? We have no idea what happened, but I'm pretty sure he shouldn't have been taking the law into his own hands.

 

[jeebus]

I want the guy to be innocent. I really do. I just don't believe he is. I misspoke. The police DISPATCHER told him not to follow him. They would be on the way. He did anyway. Was he going to rob someone while they were en route? I doubt he could and get away with that in the time it would've taken them to arrive. If he was suspicious and the police were on their way, why does he need to chase him?

So he should be charged with following a guy and he should suffer the full punishment for that crime.

I caught a guy crawling through my window in East Austin one time. I lived in an old house by an ally for a couple semesters while in school. Well, apparently, they thought the house was still empty and I met him at the window with a baseball bat and said you might want to think about what you're doing. He was startled and explained he didn't have a place to stay and was just looking for shelter. I probably should have called the cops, but I sorta felt for the guy and let him go. Could have whacked his head since he was on his way through my window... I just didn't feel like killing anyone. I bet Zimmerman wishes he would have thought a little before he went all anarchist on Trayvon.

Point taken, I bet he agrees, but if you did swing (in that split second decision) were murder charges appropriate? Because I feel zimmer was more justified then you were.

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

So he should be charged with following a guy and he should suffer the full punishment for that crime.

Firstly, I'm not really familiar with Fl. laws. But he did follow him and then kill him. So I don't see how one excludes the other.

Point taken, I bet he agrees, but if you did swing (in that split second decision) were murder charges appropriate? Because I feel zimmer was more justified then you were.

Hypothetically, you mean. I had restraint. My house was raised up a bit. Shoot, that house was probably some old slave quarters. Really old place, but it got the job done. Anyway, I was right above his head. It was 3am. I was at my computer desk and heard him coming in. He didn't come in and we had some dialogue and I went outside, which was stupid in hindsight. But I was pretty upset about it and my anger made me more brave than I should have been. I should have called the cops because he probably broke into someone else's house that night to sleep. In any case, I did know in the back of my mind, since I'm in Texas, that if someone comes in your house you can kill them. The only problem is he was on his way in and not all the way in. I did think about it. I just didn't act on it--and I'm glad I didn't. He was just some poor bum looking for a roof.

 

[jeebus]

Well your argument was he was wrong for following a black kid, not that he was wrong for shooting a guy banging his head into the curb as he lies defencless on the ground.

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

Well your argument was he was wrong for following a black kid, not that he was wrong for shooting a guy banging his head into the curb as he lies defencless on the ground.

I think he was wrong, since the police were on the way and the dispatcher told him not to follow. The reason they told him not to follow is because something like this could happen. And it did. He went after him knowing he had a gun, too. Did Zimmerman have a license to carry or no? That's another issue, I think. Why does the hood watch cop have a gun.

If I was on a jury (I was just a juror for one of Texas' biggest federal cases ever recently), I would have convicted him and given him whatever the minimum prison sentence is. That's the thing. I think he's guilty. But in terms of punishment, he could have acted a lot worse under other circumstances. I don't want to ruin the guys life. I just want him to be held accountable. You can't go all vigilante, hood watch cop and get away with it. That's why we have police, even though they're pretty much useless.

 

[iceberg]

I think he was wrong, since the police were on the way and the dispatcher told him not to follow. The reason they told him not to follow is because something like this could happen. And it did. He went after him knowing he had a gun, too. Did Zimmerman have a license to carry or no? That's another issue, I think. Why does the hood watch cop have a gun.

If I was on a jury (I was just a juror for one of Texas' biggest federal cases ever recently), I would have convicted him and given him whatever the minimum prison sentence is. That's the thing. I think he's guilty. But in terms of punishment, he could have acted a lot worse under other circumstances. I don't want to ruin the guys life. I just want him to be held accountable. You can't go all vigilante, hood watch cop and get away with it. That's why we have police, even though they're pretty much useless.

After telling the police dispatcher that Martin "ran,"[200] Zimmerman left his vehicle to determine his location and ascertain in which direction Martin had fled.[194][201] The dispatcher asked if Zimmerman was following Martin, and Zimmerman replied "Yeah." Then the dispatcher said, "OK, we don't need you to do that." Zimmerman replied with "OK" and stated that Martin got away.[200] After a discussion about where Zimmerman would meet police, the call ended, and Zimmerman told investigators he was returning to his vehicle when Martin approached him from his left rear and confronted him.[194][195] According to Zimmerman, Martin then punched him in the face, knocking him down, and began beating his head against the sidewalk.[194][195] Zimmerman said he called out for help while being beaten, and at one point Martin covered his mouth to muffle the screams.[194][195] According to Zimmerman's father, during the struggle while Martin was on top of Zimmerman, Martin saw the gun his son was carrying and said something to the effect of "You're gonna die now" or "You're gonna die tonight" and continued to beat Zimmerman.[193] Zimmerman and Martin struggled over the gun, and Zimmerman shot Martin once in the chest at close range, in self-defense.[194][195][196][Note 5]

so he was told not to follow him and he stopped and martin then came and confronted zimmerman.

 

[jeebus]

I think he was wrong, since the police were on the way and the dispatcher told him not to follow. The reason they told him not to follow is because something like this could happen. And it did. He went after him knowing he had a gun, too. Did Zimmerman have a license to carry or no? That's another issue, I think. Why does the hood watch cop have a gun.

He had a license. So the only thing you think he did illegal was follow a guy he shouldn't follow a guy? That is not illegal, you are wrong.

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

He had a license. So the only thing you think he did illegal was follow a guy he shouldn't follow a guy? That is not illegal, you are wrong.

Fair enough. I just didn't know.

Yes it is if he wasn't doing anything. You can't act like the police if you're not the police.

Let me ask you a question, do you think Trayvon was really going to kill Zimmerman?

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

After telling the police dispatcher that Martin "ran,"[200] Zimmerman left his vehicle to determine his location and ascertain in which direction Martin had fled.[194][201] The dispatcher asked if Zimmerman was following Martin, and Zimmerman replied "Yeah." Then the dispatcher said, "OK, we don't need you to do that." Zimmerman replied with "OK" and stated that Martin got away.[200] After a discussion about where Zimmerman would meet police, the call ended, and Zimmerman told investigators he was returning to his vehicle when Martin approached him from his left rear and confronted him.[194][195] According to Zimmerman, Martin then punched him in the face, knocking him down, and began beating his head against the sidewalk.[194][195] Zimmerman said he called out for help while being beaten, and at one point Martin covered his mouth to muffle the screams.[194][195] According to Zimmerman's father, during the struggle while Martin was on top of Zimmerman, Martin saw the gun his son was carrying and said something to the effect of "You're gonna die now" or "You're gonna die tonight" and continued to beat Zimmerman.[193] Zimmerman and Martin struggled over the gun, and Zimmerman shot Martin once in the chest at close range, in self-defense.[194][195][196][Note 5]

so he was told not to follow him and he stopped and martin then came and confronted zimmerman.

Who's to say Trayvon wasn't acting in self-defense? How do you know Zimmerman never did anything to him? The bottom line is he knew better and he knew the cops were on their way. He should have just held tight.

 

[iceberg]

Who's to say Trayvon wasn't acting in self-defense? How do you know Zimmerman never did anything to him? The bottom line is he knew better and he knew the cops were on their way. He should have just held tight.

george was going back to his car and NOT following him any longer. martin could have just continued home but he confronted zimmerman.

on the wiki page it also said that martin was *behind* several of the houses, not on the sidewalk.

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

george was going back to his car and NOT following him any longer. martin could have just continued home but he confronted zimmerman.

on the wiki page it also said that martin was *behind* several of the houses, not on the sidewalk.

He must have been looking for a large Mexican to attack behind the houses. No?

 

[iceberg]

He must have been looking for a large Mexican to attack behind the houses. No?

no idea what he was looking for. but if you live in a neighborhood where crime/theft is high, and you see a stranger walking around behind houses, you just gonna go "meh" and go your own merry way?

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

no idea what he was looking for. but if you live in a neighborhood where crime/theft is high, and you see a stranger walking around behind houses, you just gonna go "meh" and go your own merry way?

I would probably call the cops or do nothing if they weren't messing with my stuff. I definitely wouldn't follow him. From the 911 tape, I honestly think Zimmerman followed hoodie.

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

no idea what he was looking for. but if you live in a neighborhood where crime/theft is high, and you see a stranger walking around behind houses, you just gonna go "meh" and go your own merry way?

You have no idea what he's looking for, but crime is high. So he's probably looking for something criminal. I mean, let's assume the worsts.

 

[iceberg]

You have no idea what he's looking for, but crime is high. So he's probably looking for something criminal. I mean, let's assume the worsts.

i don't assume much of anything. but in a high crime neighborhood you put yourself at risk by acting in a manner people would question.

zimmerman followed, told not to, returned to car, martin came at him when he could have just walked away and been home before the police even got there. he bears responsibility for his actions as well as zimmerman.

 

[Ben_in_Austin]

i don't assume much of anything. but in a high crime neighborhood you put yourself at risk by acting in a manner people would question.

zimmerman followed, told not to, returned to car, martin came at him when he could have just walked away and been home before the police even got there. he bears responsibility for his actions as well as zimmerman.

I just don't believe Martin came at him unprovoked in any manner whatsoever. If that's the case, he must have been in the hood looking for a fight... not to rob someone, no?

 

[jeebus]

I would probably call the cops or do nothing if they weren't messing with my stuff. I definitely wouldn't follow him. From the 911 tape, I honestly think Zimmerman followed hoodie.

That is where we differ, I would definitely follow him