dbair1967

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. What we are watching is 10 times worse than what Trump did on Jan 6.
Agree with your whole post except this. Trump did nothing.

The audio and transcripts of the speech prove it, and so does the now well known fact that he pre-emptively requested additional resources and National Guard support there, and was denied.
 

yimyammer

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I was going to mention that and you beat me to it.

Trump did absolutely NOTHING and one of my unhinged libtard friends was called onto the carpet for that by me, and once again when I asked for specific examples of what Trump did all I got was "he tried to overthrow the government and incited a riot"....I said ok, how did he do that exactly? And I got crickets again. Kind of like the "Trump is a racist!!!!!" garbage they all whine about about but can never give any specifics of.

I've always been too busy to do the level of research I know I'll have to do in order to arrive at what I feel is an evidence based, logical and accurate conclusion about the variety of accusations made about Trump.

However, the case in NYC where Trump got fined 380+ million for a real estate transaction pulled me in because real estate is what I do so I can confidently evaluate the evidence, etc. So I dove in and the more I read, the more pissed I got as this should have never gone to trial much less resulted in a fine of this magnitude. I've started to digest the current case in NYC with no defined crime and I'm getting more pissed. I'm hearing that documents in the Florida case that were once redacted are revealing facts that make that prosecution look just as absurd. Don't get me started with the Jan 6th being described as an "insurrection"

What's scary is most people wont take the time to consider the merits of these cases and will conclude he's probably guilty of something and even if he's never convicted, it will probably be enough to cause them to vote for Biden assuming only crazy MAGA types think Trump is innocent

Like you, I've encountered rabid Trump haters who always feel entitled to give arrogant speeches about how fucked up the country is because of Trump but lose it if you try to engage them with any discourse that contradicts their sermons. I ran into a gal I've known for years at a coffee shop who started ranting about how the country was in peril because Roe vs Wade was overturned by "old, white men who want to control women bodies". I couldnt help myself and started laughing when she said that and said with all due respect, I think we have far more important issues to focus on (China, national debt, border, etc) plus the assertion you made about old, white men is nonsense because there are millions of women who oppose abortion.

Her face turned white and you would have thought I punched her in the face and said "I didnt realize you were a right-winger"

I tried to engage her more on the topic she brought up but she shut the conversation down by saying she already knew where I stood so talking would make no difference since she knew I was already set in my ways. :icon-lol:

The combination of ignorance and hubris required to make such a statement is astounding, especially considering the sum total of all political talks we've had couldn't be more than 5 minutes and all occurred during this brief exchange.

Daboys did the same thing when she sent me cowardly private message full of nonsense and then closed her message by saying she wouldn't read anything I responded with so don't bother replying.

The battle cry of the weak is to put a finger in each ear and scream "I CANT HEAR YOU!!!" like a petulant child, its hilarious and pathetic
 

Creeper

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I have not be very happy with the way the lawyers for Trump have handled this case. I thought they should have appealed more of Merchan's decisions and, like he has done with the Jack Smith cases, appeal them right up to the Supreme Court. Merchan has made several reversible errors already but I don't think he cares. What he wants is a guilty verdict knowing it might be many months before Trump has an appeal heard. To be honest, I think Merch already knows the NY appellate courts will drag their feet or even deny Trump's appeals. Just look at his appeal of the real estate case. The court only lowered his bond to $175 million - for a case with no victim. Imagine having to pay $175 million just to have an appeal heard. That is not due process.

But the good news is, there is precedent for Trump to appeal the verdict in this NY case directly to the Supreme Court. The SCOTUS can intercede in certain circumstances and a threat to democracy is one of them. This case has the potential to threaten the democratic process if the judge orders Trump incarcerated, or in any way restricted from running his campaign. Listening the the argument and justices during the immunity hearings, I am fairly certain the SCOTUS justices can't wait for one of these Trump cases to come before them. I think they will quickly stay and sentences and grant an emergency appeal hearing. Then they will overturn a conviction on due process claims if Trump is convicted.
 

Creeper

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Agree with your whole post except this. Trump did nothing.

The audio and transcripts of the speech prove it, and so does the now well known fact that he pre-emptively requested additional resources and National Guard support there, and was denied.

I should probably explain myself. When I said it was worse than anything Trump did, I should have said anything they are accusing him of doing. I understand he did nothing wrong on Jan 6. Remember, he only attempted to use the courts to have his complaints about voter fraud heard just like Al Gore did with the Florida vote in 2000. Gore sued to stop the certification of the Florida vote results and the Florida Supreme Court granted his request, in direct conflict with Florida law. It seems the media has forgotten that one. Remember how they attacked Katherine Harris because she wanted to certify the vote on the date required by law?
 

Creeper

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The NY jury has started deliberations and have already requested transcripts of testimony and for the judge to repeat his instructions to the jury.

I think this is a bad sign for Trump if he was hoping for an acquittal. It doesn't mean a guilty verdict but the fact that they are even considering testimony when there is no crime means the jury has fully or partially bought the DAs arguments that laws were violated.

Assuming there are a couple of ringers on this jury, and I am pretty sure there are, this is what deliberations will look like. They will take there time, pretend to be considering the evidence, and bullying anyone who might be considering a not guilty verdict. It will be methodical and intense. Anyone holding out for a not guilty verdict will have to have a titanium backbone. We know this because we have heard from other juries where 1 strong personality who just happened to be the foreperson, basically refused to allow anyone to vote any other way than her way.
 

touchdown

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Trump congratulated Alito for “showing the INTELLIGENCE, COURAGE, and ‘GUTS’” in refusing to step aside. “All U.S. Judges, Justices, and Leaders should have such GRIT,” Trump posted on his Truth Social platform.

 

touchdown

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At Texas GOP convention, Republicans call for spiritual warfare

At the three-day convention, delegates moved the needle further to the right, preaching Christian nationalism and approving rules that would give them unprecedented control of elections.

 

daboyz

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A reporter asked Joe Biden if he planned to serve the full four-year term if he wins back the White House.

The president responded by asking the journalist if he’d fallen on his head.

The exchange occurred at Philadelphia International Airport on Wednesday soon after Biden had arrived on Air Force One for campaign events.

Kamala Harris Listening GIF by Election 2020
“President Biden, will you be serving your full four-year term or handing over power to Vice President [Kamala] Harris,” the reporter asked.

“Are you OK? Are you alright?” replied Biden.

The pair struggled to hear each other over background noise.

The journalist repeated his question: “All four years or handing over?”

“You’re not hurt are you? I said are you OK? Did you fall on your head or something?”
Come Again Excuse Me GIF by GIPHY News

Watch the exchange here:
 

Creeper

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A reporter asked Joe Biden if he planned to serve the full four-year term if he wins back the White House.

The president responded by asking the journalist if he’d fallen on his head.

The exchange occurred at Philadelphia International Airport on Wednesday soon after Biden had arrived on Air Force One for campaign events.

Kamala Harris Listening GIF by Election 2020
“President Biden, will you be serving your full four-year term or handing over power to Vice President [Kamala] Harris,” the reporter asked.

“Are you OK? Are you alright?” replied Biden.

The pair struggled to hear each other over background noise.

The journalist repeated his question: “All four years or handing over?”

“You’re not hurt are you? I said are you OK? Did you fall on your head or something?”
Come Again Excuse Me GIF by GIPHY News

Watch the exchange here:

Biden does this all the time, but Trump is the mean guy.
 

VTA

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The Party of Dementia has found Trump guilty on all 34 felony counts.
If by some grace an appeal overturns it, you know they'll take the next step.

Too bad the real Americans can't be as ferocious in it's defense of our country as these demented savages are in destroying it. Milquetoast cucks will 'tweet' out their indignation, but nothing more.
 

Creeper

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GUILTY!!

As expected the NY jury returned a guilty verdict against Donald Trump on all 34 counts - which is in itself a bunch of nonsense since it is really only 1 count. I said this jury was rigged from the beginning and now I am almost certain it was rigged. Republicans will never win these cases until they realize that we are already in a civil war for the future of this country. The Democrats are playing hardball while Republicans are playing legal patty-cake.

I am so angry right now I am spitting fireballs.

Either we get in this fight and play by their rules or they are going to trample us. There must be consequences for them. They think they are above the law because they control the law.

I blame the DA, the NY Courts, the judge and not to be left out, the jurors. They were in this for a guilty verdict before this trial started. They convicted Trump, not because he is guilty of a crime but because he is Donald Trump. Once we know their names, and we will know their names because they won't be able to resist coming out and gloating, we will see the truth.

Understand what this case is about. Trump was accused of misdemeanor falsifying business records charges because he paid Michael Cohen over $400k in installments after Cohen negotiated an NDA with Stormy Daniels and then paid her out of his pocket. Each installment is considered 1 count. First, the idea to pay Cohen in installments was Cohen's acting as Trump's lawyer. Why all the payments are a crime when he only had to be repaid $130k, is another mystery. The statute of limitations had already run out on these charges, except that the DA elevated the misdemeanors to felonies claiming the records were falsified to cover up another crime. What crime you ask? Good question. Pick one of 3! None of which Trump was charged with! I have to see the jury verdict to see if it identifies the other crime. But remember, Trump paid Cohen, his attorney, and categorized the payments as legal fees. This is what Bragg called fraud. Bragg never identified how the legal fees paid by Trump should have been classified. Somehow this constituted some kind of election law violation except the payments were made after the election and entered into the accounting system after Trump had already won. NY law says you can't prevent or promote someone in an election by unlawful means. What unlawful means? Who knows? And if it was after the election, who cares? How can you promote of prevent someone from getting elected after the election took place?

The jurors know, or do they? This is why I hold a special contempt for the jurors. We know and they know they lied their way onto this jury with the sole intent of convicting Trump no matter what the crime, or no crime, and what the evidence.

The war is underway. The only question is, are Republicans going to fight back or do nothing like they usually do. Strongly worded letters will not work. Trump is just the first. It could be any Republican running for office and this is the part Republicans seem to be missing. Pandora's box is open. Nothing stops them from indicting whoever runs for president open bogus charges in a city like NY and getting a conviction.

Now it is up to the Supreme Court. I have been asking John Roberts to come down hard on these lawless judges for years and he chickens out. Trump needs to make an emergency appeal to the SCOTUS and the SCOTUS has to take the case and issue an immediate order to vacate the verdict and order a retrial in a location other than NY, or just throw it out with prejudice and scold the prosecutor, judge and jury. Roberts needs to issue a warming the political prosecutions will not be tolerated.
 

VTA

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That is correct Ted, you're 'watching'. You're 'doing' nothing, while the party of Dementia
ignores the constitution.

Screen Shot 2024-05-30 at 7.15.10 PM.png
 

yimyammer

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34 felony counts

:icon-lol: at 34 felonies, isnt that like charging someone with 10 felonies (1 for each bullet) for murdering someone because they shot them 10 times?

It wasnt 34 instances of her being silenced, it was one instance that was paid for via 17 invoices and 17 checks

Here's the list (which IIUC, is merely 17 invoices and 17 checks written and entered into the accounting system that produced the financial statements. Which begs the question, how does falsifying business records that the voting public has no access to and will never see keep the voting public from knowing payments were made for her silence?

Its her silence that accomplishes this, no?

Here's the list of "falsifying business records in the first degree":

Count 1 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about February 14, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated February 14, 2017, marked as a record of the Donald J. Trump Revocable Trust, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 2 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about February 14, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for the Donald J. Trump Revocable Trust, bearing voucher number 842457, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 3 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about February 14, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for the Donald J. Trump Revocable Trust, bearing voucher number 842460, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 4 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about February 14, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump Revocable Trust Account check and check stub dated February 14, 2017, bearing check number 000138, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 5 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about March 16, 2017 through March 17, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated February 16, 2017 and transmitted on or about March 16, 2017, marked as a record of the Donald J. Trump Revocable Trust, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 6 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about March 17, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for the Donald J. Trump Revocable Trust, bearing voucher number 846907, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 7 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about March 17, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump Revocable Trust Account check and check stub dated March 17, 2017, bearing check number 000147, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 8 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about April 13, 2017 through June 19, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated April 13, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 9 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about June 19, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 858770, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 10 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about June 19, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated June 19, 2017, bearing check number 002740, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 11 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about May 22, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated May 22, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 12 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about May 22, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 855331, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 13 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about May 23, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated May 23, 2017, bearing check number 002700, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 14 (falsifying business records in the first degree):​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about June 16, 2017 through June 19, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated June 16, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 15 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty​

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about June 19, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 858772, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 16 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about June 19, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated June 19, 2017, bearing check number 002741, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 17 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about July 11, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated July 11, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 18 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about July 11, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 861096, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 19 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about July 11, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated July 11, 2017, bearing check number 002781, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 20 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about August 1, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated August 1, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 21 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about August 1, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 863641, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 22 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about August 1, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated August 1, 2017, bearing check number 002821, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 23 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about September 11, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated September 11, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 24 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about September 11, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 868174, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 25 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about September 12, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated September 12, 2017, bearing check number 002908, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 26 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about October 18, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated October 18, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 27 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about October 18, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 872654, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 28 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about October 18, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated October 18, 2017, bearing check number 002944, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 29 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about November 20, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated November 20, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 30 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about November 20, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 876511, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 31 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about November 21, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated November 21, 2017, bearing check number 002980, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 32 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about December 1, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an invoice from Michael Cohen dated December 1, 2017, marked as a record of Donald J. Trump, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 33 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about December 1, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, an entry in the Detail General Ledger for Donald J. Trump, bearing voucher number 877785, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”

Count 34 (falsifying business records in the first degree): Guilty

“The defendant, in the County of New York and elsewhere, on or about December 5, 2017, with intent to defraud and intent to commit another crime and aid and conceal the commission thereof, made and caused a false entry in the business records of an enterprise, to wit, a Donald J. Trump account check and check stub dated December 5, 2017, bearing check number 003006, and kept and maintained by the Trump Organization.”
 

yimyammer

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remember, Trump paid Cohen, his attorney, and categorized the payments as legal fees. This is what Bragg called fraud. Bragg never identified how the legal fees paid by Trump should have been classified.

What I dont understand is why the defense didnt bring up the fact that the financial statements where the supposed falsification took place are not in the public record for people to see, so the voters could never be fooled by the misclassification in the first place
 
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