Hoofbite

Draft Pick
Messages
4,231
Reaction score
0
I've been meaning to post something I thought about regarding the roster turnover bullshit.

The general idea is that Garrett isn't doing a bad job because he's had to rebuilding the roster. He gets some sort of pass for this, I guess? The 3 year plan should start now or something?

At the same time, ask any of these people how Garrett has done at rebuilding the roster and they'll be more than happy to tell you what a great job he has done.

I think he's done okay. 2011 was a very solid draft but 2012 could be a fucking disaster if Mo doesn't pull his head out of his ass and start playing like a guy who deserves the highest DB grade since Deion. The biggest contributor so far has been 6th round James Hannah and they fucking drafted someone to surpass him in 2013 which is infuriating considering this lumbering neanderthal only gets about 12 snaps per week. All in all 1 very good draft, 1 draft that could be very good if some of the late round guys make up for the fucked up #47 overall pick, and one draft that is bordering on 2009-like disaster status.

Anyway, so here's the question,

If Garrett inherited a shitty roster and went 8-8 in 2011, why is Dallas on pace to finish 8-8 (yet again) after 3 full offseasons of Garrett's awesome roster building?

Guy takes a shitty team depleted of talent and goes 8-8. Does a good job of rebuilding for two more years and still goes 8-8, with the current projected 8-8 coming on the back of one of the weakest schedules in recent memory.

Something isn't adding up here. Either Garrett hasn't done nearly as good of a job at building the roster as they would claim (I think he's done pretty well aside from 2012 so I'm willing to say that's not the case), or Jason Garrett doesn't add anything to the team on Sundays. He puts on a good show, makes the players media savvy to a certain extent and has them saying all the right things but when it comes right down to what happens on Sundays, Jason Garrett doesn't bring a single fucking thing to the table to add to his team's talent and abilities.

A good coach can get more out of his team than an average coach can. Sean Payton goes 13-3, 11-5, 13-3 and then gets suspended. Saints finish 7-9 in 2012. Sean Payton comes back, brings in Rob Ryan and the Saints are sitting at 7-2 after having kicked the absolute dogshit out of the same .500 Dallas team that took them into overtime less than a full season ago.

  • Andy Reid goes to Kansas City after they had won a combined 9 games between 2011 and 2012, he brings in a game manager of a QB, and he has them sitting at 9 wins with his team having only played 9 games.

  • Jim Harbaugh goes to San Francisco and takes a team that had finished at or above .500 one time in the previous 8 years and he wins 13 games in his first season, 11 games his second season and is on pace for another double-digit win season.

  • Bruce Arians goes to a shitty Arizona team that came off a 5-win, 8-win, and 5-win stretch of seasons and after tomorrow against Jacksonville the Cardinals could very well be 6-4.

  • Pete Carroll went to Seattle after they won 4 games in 2008 and 5 games in 2009. Without a QB he gets the team to 7-9, finishes the season by winning the very same type of play-in game that Dallas has had over the last two years and ultimately shocks the hell out of the Saints. He then suffers through another 7 win season on the back of a slightly better but still horrible passing game, and finally after getting a guy who can play Seattle finishes with 11 wins and is currently the #1 seed in the NFC.

  • Ron Rivera inherited a Carolina team that was utter dogshit who couldn't score and couldn't stop anyone from scoring and who had finished 2-14 in John Fox's last year. He takes a 2-win team, adds a QB and improves his teams win total by 4 games in his first season. In his 2nd year the Panthers started off pretty much how you would expect a 6 win team to play but Carolina finished season winning 4 straight games. In that stretch he beat the NFL best (tied with Denver) 13-win Falcons, the Chargers and Raiders, and then finally finished the season by going into New Orleans and outscoring Drew Brees by running all over the Saints. Now his team is sitting a 6-3 and they look damn good after a slow start and haven't allowed more than 15 points in any of the last 5 games. Ron Rivera inherited the #26 ranked scoring defense. After falling to #27 in his first season, the Panthers bumped to #18 last year and they are currently 4 points away from matching KC in having the best scoring defense in the NFL. Imagine that. A HC hired because he had a reputation for being a good DC and in 3 seasons his defense has gone from one of the worst in the league to one of the best. The've allowed more than 20 points 2 times all year, one of which came against Buffalo on a pretty suspect 3rd down PI penalty with 0:21 left to play in the game. After their loss in week 5 they kick the shit out of their next 4 opponents and most recently knocked off the 49ers, holding them to about 150 yards of total offense.

  • Cleveland has not won more than 5 games in any of the past 5 fucking season. They're also currently starting their #3 QB but unless they really go to shit they'll undoubtedly win more than 5 games in Rob Chudzinki's first year because they play the Jaguars once and the Steelers twice.

Granted, Arians and Chudzinski are first year coaches and they could go to shit just as easily as they could continue to turn things around but they've stepped in and improved their teams. Chudzinski is currently starting Jason Campbell and a win tomorrow would put them at 5-5. 5-5 with Jason Fucking Campbell coming from two spots deep off the bench. Dallas has a QB far better than Campell and yet here we are. Romo has more TDs this year than Jason Campbell has ever thrown for in a complete season. During this 3 year OTJ training program for Garrett, Romo has thrown 1 fewer TD than Jason Campbell has thrown in his entire career.

These other coaches though have had a very pronounced impact that has shown up in the win column. Ron Rivera has increased his teams wins every year and he plays in one of the toughest divisions out there. Not even shitty QB play has fucked over Harbaugh and Carroll's team is the class of the NFC. Andy Reid is going to be coach of the year which unless I am mistaken is given to the coach who does the best job by getting more from his team than anyone would have ever expected.

Bottom line, something isn't adding up here in Dallas. You can't say the guy is doing a great job of rebuilding the roster, doing a good job of coaching, and then NOT ask why it hasn't shown up in the win column. It's just mentally lazy to accept the exact same outcome when you're comparing year 1 when the roster was supposedly shitty to year 3 when the roster is supposedly much improved. This is the parity-driven NFL and it doesn't take half a 3 or 4 year plan to see a team pull out one additional win when going from one season to the next.

I've said it before, I think Jason earned the right to get a HC shot by taking a quitting team and getting them 5 wins with same quality of QB that Chudzinski is currently sandbagged by. This after I had pretty much concluded he was a shitty offensive coordinator. The way the team responded in his first half season was impressive, IMO. Since that time however I haven't seen a damn thing to suggest he should keep his job as HC and quite honestly if I were calling the shots he would have been out the door last year. After watching his offense do next to nothing for the first 2 quarters every week and then suddenly come alive once they ditched the game plan he would have had a little explaining to do. After losing a 2nd play-in game in week 17 he would have been cleaning out his office. And really, when you think about how that 2011 season ended with Dallas basically tossing in the towel agains the Eagles he probably shouldn't have been given a chance to return at that point. I don't care if it "didn't mean anything" because Dallas would have missed the playoffs had they lost the following week in either scenario. You tell your team it's okay to quit, you can get the fuck on down the road.

Jason Garrett is not a good head coach. Will he be at some point in the future? Who knows. Perhaps he needs a little dose of reality by getting shit-canned in order to kick start a little self-reflection. For fuck's sake he was handed an OC position (with Assistant Head Coach label attached) without having a pit of experience in calling plays at any level. From there he defaulted into a HC position by getting the team to put out a little effort. Perhaps he needs a little helping of failure to wake up and realize that simply saying the right things and projecting the imagine of doing the right things will work. That facade has gotten him this far.

Ron Rivera cranks out a top not defense in just 3 short years. Jason Garrett's had 8 years now and Dallas still fucking struggles on offense. How much shit you gotta stack before it starts putting points on the board on a consistent basis? Right now I don't think he adds much of anything to the team in terms of what happens on Sundays. Given some of the fucking debacles that have occurred on his watch you could make a pretty damn strong argument that he does the complete opposite.
 
Messages
8,660
Reaction score
0
Great post...

While reading it through the lens of Jerry Jones GM running this team, I started to think he sounds a lot like Jerry. And we all know how much Jerry loves Garrett. My nightmare is thinking Garrett is as secure in his job as Jerry is in his job as the GM. Jerry wants to prove to everyone that he's a legit GM. This is now the 7th year he has invested in Garrett, and he has given him every opportunity to prove he can do the job, and get himself some credit for seeing it "back when he was a QB here."

I feel even more pessimistic about this team. Didn't think that was possible.
 

ThoughtExperiment

Quality Starter
Messages
9,906
Reaction score
3
Great post...

While reading it through the lens of Jerry Jones GM running this team, I started to think he sounds a lot like Jerry. And we all know how much Jerry loves Garrett. My nightmare is thinking Garrett is as secure in his job as Jerry is in his job as the GM. Jerry wants to prove to everyone that he's a legit GM. This is now the 7th year he has invested in Garrett, and he has given him every opportunity to prove he can do the job, and get himself some credit for seeing it "back when he was a QB here."

I feel even more pessimistic about this team. Didn't think that was possible.
I'm afraid of that, too. And it's very possible. As you say, this isn't a three-year experiment. This is a the seventh year of Jerry's master plan to install his boy. And he's perfect because he's completely beholden to Jerry, which is a key reason Jerry wanted him in the first place.

So Garrett might be even more secure than we thought. :suicide

The one hope I see is that there's heat on Garrett like I've never seen the last week or so, and even Jerry has to sense that. But the bad news is, we beat a bad Giants team then just manage to not puke ourselves against a terrible Raiders team -- not any kind of achievement and something any number of decent teams could do -- and everyone will be 100% back on the bandwagon.

But if Jerry gives Garrett an extension after this year, I really might be done with this team.
 

Jon88

Pro Bowler
Messages
19,523
Reaction score
0
We're an adjustment here, an adjustment there, and I know firsthand that our quarterback, our offensive coordinator, our head coach, our entire offensive staff are looking, evaluating and making adjustments. And I think they're making the kind of adjustments that are called for -- not dramatic, but the kinds that can make a difference in a route, how we bunch them up, how we do things to have a lot more production and keep that defense off the field. It needs some help, to say the least.
 
Messages
46,859
Reaction score
5
I don't know if Jason survives another 8-8 season. I think the heat will be on significantly when the Giants beat us next week.
 

cmd34

Pro Bowler
Messages
11,877
Reaction score
119
Short of a playoff victory, not appearance, Garrett is done here.

What's undetermined is if Jones brings in someone with the clout to insist on total control.
 

SixisBetter

Anywhere on the line.
Messages
4,211
Reaction score
370
You write that Hoof?
Cause that's pretty good.
I've been thinking that myself.
Why are these other teams willing to eat shit for a year or two to build a better team,and Jerry keeps hiring guys.......oh.wait.
 

junk

UDFA
Messages
2,719
Reaction score
0
Good post. There has always been this belief at CZ that Garrett just needed the right players and his system would work. Unfortunately, that appears to be All Pros across the offensive side of the ball.

And let's be honest about this roster rebuild. Who has he drafted that would be considered a cornerstone player? Tyron Smith is probably about it. Maybe Frederick. He drafted a RB who has yet to have a 1,000 yard season. A guy in Carter who seems to be splitting time with a guy they picked up off the street. A high round CB who has looked less than dominating so far (although I'm not ready to give up on him yet) Dwayne Harris and James Hanna might be his best picks outside of Smith and Frederick.

I think people want to try to give him credit for Lee and Dez, but they came under Phillips.

Garrett just doesn't seem very creative to me. I think he has his system and his offense and the thought of tweaking to match the talents of his players doesn't even cross his mind. Dez could be used better. I don't think he has a clue how to use Dwayne Harris. Same for Dunbar and even Escobar.

If he stays, I'd like to see a purge of the offensive staff and bring in someone new. I really, really wish the Dan Reeves thing had worked out as that is what Garrett needed/still needs. An accomplished offensive veteran coach to mentor him on game management and game planning.
 

Jon88

Pro Bowler
Messages
19,523
Reaction score
0
Garrett is in way over his head. He looks like a deer in the headlights every game. His players don't respect him, he's not a motivator, he can't put a gameplan together, and he is the worst I have ever seen at clock management. And who the fuck ices their own kicker? Fucking moron. He MIGHT be qualified to be a quarterbacks coach. Offensive coordinator? No way. Head coach? Absolutely not.

We might go 5-11 this year. That would be fine with me. We need to clean house. We're in the same boat we were in when we had Campo. The only difference is we have more talent at a few positions. The depth is once again gone, the cap is screwed, and the coaching is the worst in the league.
 
Messages
3,665
Reaction score
22
Nothing wrong with bursting the balloon of Garrett supporters and Hoof does just that.

Honestly, though, I don't see how keeping or firing Garrett makes any difference over the next several seasons. The championship window has closed on the core of this team and Jerry won't go into true rebuild mode until the team is flaying about helplessly (as in Campo's last year as head coach).

Fire Garrett or keep Garrett, IMO it doesn't make any difference. This team is in a slow downward decline and a change of coaches isn't going to change that.
 

Hoofbite

Draft Pick
Messages
4,231
Reaction score
0
You write that Hoof?
Cause that's pretty good.
I've been thinking that myself.
Why are these other teams willing to eat shit for a year or two to build a better team,and Jerry keeps hiring guys.......oh.wait.

Yeah, didn't think it would be that long but when you start looking around the league the number of teams who hire a guy and start seeing positive results increases from what you could think of off the top of your head.

I'm not so sure about teams being willing to eat shit. I'm more jealous of their ability to recognize they eat shit rather than stay the course.
 

Hoofbite

Draft Pick
Messages
4,231
Reaction score
0
Nothing wrong with bursting the balloon of Garrett supporters and Hoof does just that.

Honestly, though, I don't see how keeping or firing Garrett makes any difference over the next several seasons. The championship window has closed on the core of this team and Jerry won't go into true rebuild mode until the team is flaying about helplessly (as in Campo's last year as head coach).

Fire Garrett or keep Garrett, IMO it doesn't make any difference. This team is in a slow downward decline and a change of coaches isn't going to change that.

Well hopefully a change of coaches would prevent a complete bottoming out. I have no interest in seeing Dallas win 4 or 5 games for a couple of years.

Shit it isn't even like 8-8 is that fucking good in the first place and even without anything Campo won 5 games.
 

yimyammer

Pro Bowler
Messages
10,181
Reaction score
4,042
Short of a playoff victory, not appearance, Garrett is done here.

What's undetermined is if Jones brings in someone with the clout to insist on total control.

Ha! Not a chance!!
 

diehard2294

Practice Squad
Messages
427
Reaction score
0
My fear is Jerry thinks he has the next Sean Payton in Garrett and he doesn't want to pull the cord on his pet. I fear he will use the injuries as his excuse. If the season goes sour Callahan and grandpa will be gone and I believe Marrinelli will be the new DC
 

dbair1967

Administrator
Messages
58,597
Reaction score
9,075
I think the front office and coaching staff need to be rebuilt more than the roster (which needs tons of help too)
 
Top Bottom