DMN: The five best Dallas Cowboys QBs of all-time, ranked

[bbgun]

I think it's closer than you two are suggesting. Jimmy took a 1-15 team and won a SB with them 3 years later. That's one of the most amazing coaching feats in the history of the NFL.

True, but suckering the Vikings greatly accelerated our return to the land of the living. Landry had no such advantage when he inherited a dreadful expansion team in 1960.

 

[cmd34]

Exactly, and so far my post is the only objective one on the coaches.

How is mine not objective?

Does objective mean agrees with you?

It was a tough call for me. Jimmy did more in a shorter time. Landry was a legend but was awful towards the end, probably stayed in a few too many years. Love 'em both.

 

[cmd34]

but suckering the Vikings

Part of his greatness.

Landry and Schramm did some bamboozling as well, especially in regards to draft day trades. It's a positive in what makes them great.

 

[Iamtdg]

Part of his greatness.

Yep.

 

[NoMoRedJ]

How is mine not objective?

Does objective mean agrees with you?

It was a tough call for me. Jimmy did more in a shorter time. Landry was a legend but was awful towards the end, probably stayed in a few too many years. Love 'em both.

Yours isnt objective because you put Jimmy ahead of Landry.


And I wouldnt hold Landry's last few years against him. His greatness was already established.

 

[bbgun]

Part of his greatness.

Landry and Schramm did some bamboozling as well, especially in regards to draft day trades. It's a positive in what makes them great.

but never a windfall like that. and had Jimmy stayed around long enough, he would have been saddled with some bad teams himself due to free agency and the salary cap. that said, he wouldn't have drafted stiffs like Carver, Carter and Goodrich.

 

[Iamtdg]

Landry couldn't adapt to how the game was changing. That's why his last few years sucked. It's a ding against him. I loved Landry as a coach, but it's close between him and Jimmy.

 

[NoMoRedJ]

but never a windfall like that. and had Jimmy stayed around long enough, he would have been saddled with some bad teams himself due to free agency and the salary cap. that said, he wouldn't have drafted stiffs like Carver, Carter and Goodrich.

Jimmy didnt look so great in Miami. Doesnt matter for us Cowboy fans, but its a mark on his career.

 

[NoMoRedJ]

Landry couldn't adapt to how the game was changing. That's why his last few years sucked. It's a ding against him. I loved Landry as a coach, but it's close between him and Jimmy.

Joe Gibbs said that Landry was still tough to coach against and that the game hadnt passed him by.

Landry didnt have enough talent toward the end.

It wasnt any fun in the late 80's watching the Cowboys thats for sure.

 

[cmd34]

Jimmy didnt look so great in Miami. Doesnt matter for us Cowboy fans, but its a mark on his career.

He was 36-28 and made the playoffs 3 out of his 4 years.

In Landry's last 4 years, he was 27-36 and made the playoffs once.

 

[ZeroClub]

Staubach, Aikman, Romo, White, Meredith

Landry hung on a little too long and some people remember those later years, but he was a true master of his profession, especially in the 1970's. He understood football, on both sides of the ball, as well as anyone ever has. (semi-interesting read here: link)

Jimmy Johnson built one of the all-time great teams, had a remarkably successful run, but his tenure was relatively brief (1989 to 1993). In short, he didn't do it over the long term and so didn't face the kinds of challenges that longer tenured coaches do (e.g., making scheme adjustments to accommodate physical decline in star players or to capitalize on his maturing QB's growing expertise). Gale Sayers and Bo Jackson were truly great pro RBs players, but only for a short period of time. Johnson was like that too, I think.

Then Parcells (in Dallas).

It starts to get murky after that. Give Wade or Garrett the same team that Switzer inherited and I think there is a great chance that both Wade and Garrett win at least as many Super Bowls as Switzer. I'd be tempted to put Wade at 4 and Garrett at 5.

Gailey, Switzer, Campo ... difficult for me to differentiate much. Campo's rosters weren't very good. He wasn't either. His teams tended to play hard for him, so at least he had that.

 

[NoMoRedJ]

He was 36-28 and made the playoffs 3 out of his 4 years.

In Landry's last 4 years, he was 27-36 and made the playoffs once.

And his last game against Jacksonville in the playoffs was a beat down. He bailed and left his buddy Wannestadt to deal with the "Dan Thing"

 

[NoMoRedJ]

BTW, I love Jimmy and am not criticizing him at all. I just dont think he could ever be ranked higher than Landry.

 

[ThoughtExperiment]

Landry couldn't adapt to how the game was changing. That's why his last few years sucked.

Or was it that he didn't have a quarterback. Give him Aikman in 89 and I think things would have picked up dramatically, although not to the level Jimmy got them.

 

[ThoughtExperiment]

And to some of the people older than me... Where do you have Meredith? Well I guess I can see that in the rankings, but I'm surprised some have him below White. If anything, I've heard from close observers from back then that Don was as high as the third best QB here -- great talent, great arm, excellent leader, as tough as they come. He just got beat to a pulp.

 

[dbair1967]

Or was it that he didn't have a quarterback. Give him Aikman in 89 and I think things would have picked up dramatically, although not to the level Jimmy got them.

Aikman would have made a difference, but I think as great as Landry was that he kinda showed the game had passed him by. In the 60's and 70's (even very early 80's) Landry was a defensive genius and a true offensive innovator. He assembled great coaching staffs and was a tremendous leader. He wasn't the motivator he was either, when players truly feared him for two decades before. I don't think the Cowboys would have won any of those three super bowls in 92/93/95 if Landry had been retained.

Gil Brandt didn't exactly do him any favors with poorly run and executed drafts from the late 70's throughout most of the 80's either. And Bum Bright was a lousy owner, so Landry wasn't solely to blame. But I do believe the game had passed him by.

 

[ThoughtExperiment]

Aikman would have made a difference, but I think as great as Landry was that he kinda showed the game had passed him by. In the 60's and 70's (even very early 80's) Landry was a defensive genius and a true offensive innovator. He assembled great coaching staffs and was a tremendous leader. He wasn't the motivator he was either, when players truly feared him for two decades before. I don't think the Cowboys would have won any of those three super bowls in 92/93/95 if Landry had been retained.

Agree with that, I'm just saying the main reason for the 27-36 record was Hogeboom and Pelluer. Not even Jimmy could have won with those guys.

 

[dbair1967]

And to some of the people older than me... Where do you have Meredith? Well I guess I can see that in the rankings, but I'm surprised some have him below White. If anything, I've heard from close observers from back then that Don was as high as the third best QB here -- great talent, great arm, excellent leader, as tough as they come. He just got beat to a pulp.

I never saw him play so really cant comment. White inherited a very strong team with a ton of talent though, whereas Meredith started on a couple of those early year teams that came together in the mid 60's.

 

[TheZoneSucks]

Jimmy didnt look so great in Miami. Doesnt matter for us Cowboy fans, but its a mark on his career.

1) Jimmy coached a national championship in Miami. Lots of Cowboys fans tend to forget that despite the fact that Jimmy was the first coach in football history to win both the NCAA Championship as well as the Super Bowl.

2) As Dolphins coach he never had a losing season and his regular season win percentage at Miami was actually higher than it was in Dallas.

Jimmy didn't suck in Miami. He just didn't win the Super Bowl.

I still rank Landry 1 though, but it is definitely close. Landry had longevity on his side, as well as innovation and iconic status. Jimmy got the team to a higher peak than any Landry era team, but it burned out quicker. The 92-93 Cowboys beat any other Cowboys team in a head to head match up 2 out of 3 times. Hell, they beat any team from any era 2 out of 3 in my opinion.

Landry
Johnson
Parcells
Switzer (Aikman was the real coach)
Cup Cake
Gailey
Campo
Garrett

Garret ranks lower than Campo because Campo at least managed 5 wins each season without a real QB. Garrett goes 1-11 with two QBs better than Quincy Carter and the other stiffs Campo had to work with. Garrett might literally have posted an 0-16 season had he coached under the same situation as Campo.

 

[dbair1967]

Agree with that, I'm just saying the main reason for the 27-36 record was Hogeboom and Pelluer. Not even Jimmy could have won with those guys.

There was a lot more wrong with those 87 and 88 teams than the QB play.

The 88 team doesn't get talked about much, but it was an awful team in every phases and other than Herschel Walker and Irvin there was absolutely nothing worth a shit out there. The 43-3 loss to the Vikings at home was one of the worst games in franchise history.