superpunk

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The guys who evaluate the "available safeties" are the same braintrust who thought Alan Ball was adequate in 2010. We can't keep ignoring the position.

There's kind of a logical disconnect here where we just throw draft picks after terrible safeties just because Alan Ball sucked, which is the kind of the same reason we once started Clint Stoerner IMO.
 

Theebs

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There's kind of a logical disconnect here where we just throw draft picks after terrible safeties just because Alan Ball sucked, which is the kind of the same reason we once started Clint Stoerner IMO.

its also exactly what they did in 2000 and 2001. We had no corners and as bryan broaddus said lacewell decided to just throw numbers at the position even though the talent was not that good. So instead of taking better players at other positions, they ignored the scouting reports and threw numbers at the corner position.

it failed. The masses attacked jerry...rightfully so....they hated him.

fast forward to 2010. Similar scenario. Much better front office. The team decides to listen to the scouts and does not reach for players they do not feel will fit or be any good. They then draft good players at other positions.

the masses are upset and Jerry sucks.

oh well.
 

cmd34

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Bruce Carter is a quality linebacker BUT is coming off injury and at best, is our 4th best ILB as of right now. Rahim Moore was available and would have been an instant upgrade at FS. IMO we took a luxury pick there over a huge need and a player that fit that need. Murray is another quality player that we obviously liked. We had holes at FS, SS, DE, and Interior O Linemen and we took a RB. Another luxury pick.

Both players were good college players and hopefully will make great Cowboys but we have to address our weaknesses. That doesn't mean you have to reach for players. You trade up/down to match a player with your need if necessary.

I know some believe BPA no matter what and others here believe whatever Jerry does is magically delicious and the best move ever. IMO our GM is our biggest weakness and continues to hold us back. We had a pretty good draft overall. I just think we ignore needs way too often.
 

dbair1967

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The guys who evaluate the "available safeties" are the same braintrust who thought Alan Ball was adequate in 2010. We can't keep ignoring the position.

I doubt the scouts were the one's who put Alan Ball at safety, that was a Wade and Campo decision.

The scouts pretty much agreed with most other teams IMO, that this years safety crop was poor.
 

cmd34

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I doubt the scouts were the one's who put Alan Ball at safety, that was a Wade and Campo decision.

The scouts pretty much agreed with most other teams IMO, that this years safety crop was poor.

I didn't say it was scouts. The scouts, like the coaching staff, report to the overall talent evaluator aka the GM. I noticed you left your hero out of the the people to blame for thinking Ball was up to par. Wade and Campo AND Jerry.
 

dbair1967

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I didn't say it was scouts. The scouts, like the coaching staff, report to the overall talent evaluator aka the GM. I noticed you left your hero out of the the people to blame for thinking Ball was up to par. Wade and Campo AND Jerry.

You honestly think Jerry had anything to do with deciding to play Alan Ball at safety? I'm sure he probably discussed it with the coaches, but I doubt he had any impact on the final decision to do that at all.
Wade and Campo believed Ball could do the job. Unfortunately they were wrong.
 

cmd34

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You honestly think Jerry had anything to do with deciding to play Alan Ball at safety? I'm sure he probably discussed it with the coaches, but I doubt he had any impact on the final decision to do that at all.
Wade and Campo believed Ball could do the job. Unfortunately they were wrong.

So the GM has no say in evaluating the talent of the roster? Do you remember how many free agents the GM brought in last off-season? Zero. How about free agent visits? Zero. His excuse was he felt the players we had were up to par and no one on the free agent market would be a significant upgrade. Really? Ball was possibly one of the worst NFL starters in the league last year. So bad, that he is being moved to 4th string CB a year later. Yet last year the GM felt there was no need to upgrade.

Lets' pretend for a second that it was all Campo and Wade's fault. Who hired (and kept)both of those guys? Oh yeah...
 

dbair1967

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So the GM has no say in evaluating the talent of the roster? Do you remember how many free agents the GM brought in last off-season? Zero. How about free agent visits? Zero. His excuse was he felt the players we had were up to par and no one on the free agent market would be a significant upgrade. Really? Ball was possibly one of the worst NFL starters in the league last year. So bad, that he is being moved to 4th string CB a year later. Yet last year the GM felt there was no need to upgrade.

Lets' pretend for a second that it was all Campo and Wade's fault. Who hired (and kept)both of those guys? Oh yeah...

Nobody, I mean absolutely nobody saw this defense collapsing and being as bad as it was last yr before the season started. Virtually everyone had this team pegged for a serious championship run. It wasnt just Jones.
 

cmd34

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Nobody, I mean absolutely nobody saw this defense collapsing and being as bad as it was last yr before the season started. Virtually everyone had this team pegged for a serious championship run. It wasnt just Jones.

There were several people who questioned starting Ball. Several more who questioned allowing Wade to return after the butt kicking we took in Minnesota. Yes, many thought we would make a run but there were plenty who questioned Jerry standing pat on the coach and the roster last off-season. Personally, I thought we were one or two free agents away and most definitely an upgrade at 1 or both safety positions.
 

dbair1967

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There were several people who questioned starting Ball. Several more who questioned allowing Wade to return after the butt kicking we took in Minnesota. Yes, many thought we would make a run but there were plenty who questioned Jerry standing pat on the coach and the roster last off-season. Personally, I thought we were one or two free agents away and most definitely an upgrade at 1 or both safety positions.

Other than some forum people, nobody said a word about not bringing Wade back. As lousy a HC as Wade turned out to be (especially last yr) he really isnt to blame for one bad loss to end the 2009 playoffs. The OL was a trainwreck once they decided to start Colombo vs Minny along with Adams going down early in that game. There was no reason for Jones to make a change after the team finished strong for the first time in eons, and actually did win a playoff game for the first time in 15 yrs. Doing so would not have put Jerry in a good position with any quality candidate he might have been interested in because they'd believe Jones would do the same type of thing to them.

And Alan Ball was not the reason the defense collapsed. If others on the defense (other than Ware) had pulled their weight, his bad play wouldnt have been all that noticeable. Other than Ware, not a single guy on this defense had a good yr last yr, and thats why the defense flopped. Now alot of that is on poor game plans and ultra vanilla scheme, but some goes on the players too.
 
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Who's idea wads it to start a hobbled Columbo over Free against Minny?

Oh yeah, the guy who should have been fired...

And as for Ball, the fact they stuck with him even after playing so poorly early was a bad sign. The Olsen touchdown alone in week 2 should have been enough to go look for an upgrade.
 

superpunk

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Good thing this thread is about how much Jerry sucks for starting Alan Ball, instead of about Demarco Murray.
 

Bob Sacamano

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Thats certainly a concern, and he has been dinged up some already.

Most of his injuries has been lower body, not necessarily injuries that have anything to do with possessing an upright running style.
 
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dbair1967

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We will see.

I liked Moore as well, but I do think Bruce Carter's upside is immense and it was pretty much a concensus that if not for the ACL, Carter was the far higher rated player.
 
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