2020 NFL Week 6: Arizona Cardinals at Dallas Cowboys

[Doomsday]

No one can say that they know for sure what's going through Jerry's mind.

We CAN be 100 percent sure he's not "tanking for Lawrence."

 

[Doomsday]

I don't think that we're all that talented on the D side of the ball, to be honest.

Haven't we all known that for quite some time? We're not spending any money on the D side of the ball, for starters. You went from the Legion of Boobs to this Lesion of noobs, and still no matter who we sign we can't get any kind of respectable pass rush, and our linebackers? Walking wounded and Gimpy?

I don't see anyone besides Jerry arguing we have great talent on the D side of the ball.

 

[MrB]

You may have missed my overall point, but there's no doubt changing the entire defensive system and terminology without benefit of an offseason and preseason is malpractice. Dave Wannstedt agrees, he said so in pregame on FOX Sunday.

My POINT was, combining that with poor talent is a recipe for disaster. You well know I have always said we're bereft of talent on the D side of the ball.

Lack of prep time after installing a new defense (that doesn’t remotely fit the talent) is part of it. Obviously that’s a big part of it. Why hire a staff that doesn’t fit the talent? Especially in a season where prep time is extremely limited? Also why is Jerry not upset? He’s fired DB coaches before in the middle of a season.


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[Dodger12]

You may have missed my overall point, but there's no doubt changing the entire defensive system and terminology without benefit of an offseason and preseason is malpractice. Dave Wannstedt agrees, he said so in pregame on FOX Sunday.

My POINT was, combining that with poor talent is a recipe for disaster. You well know I have always said we're bereft of talent on the D side of the ball.

I'm too lazy to look it up but how many new HC's were hired this off-season? Are you saying NO TEAM or NEW HC in the entire NFL didn't change a scheme? Joe Judge comes to mind and he brought on the Red Dolt and his scheme. MM himself said that they've simplified the D scheme after the first or second week when someone ask him a question about the scheme being too complicated.

 

[MrB]

We CAN be 100 percent sure he's not "tanking for Lawrence."

Or either if the other two QB’s I mentioned?


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[Doomsday]

Why hire a staff that doesn’t fit the talent?

It's documented that Jerry didn't hire them. What MM was thinking, there's no idea. But really, this is what you get hiring offensive gurus as head coach - their passion and knowledge isn't on the D side of the ball. They would rather just win games by outscoring people. Not by stopping them. It's a pattern you see all over the league, for decades.

Or either if the other two QB’s I mentioned?

Any at all. "Tanking" doesn't exist. And besides, Dak is their guy. They're not looking at QBs.

 

[Doomsday]

Are you saying NO TEAM or NEW HC in the entire NFL didn't change a scheme?

Not at all. But there's a huge difference making wholesale changes to a defensive system when you also already have marginal talent when you start. Normally you can get away with it, this year as Dave said, no.

 

[Dodger12]

We CAN be 100 percent sure he's not "tanking for Lawrence."

You don't know what's going through their mind, especially with Dak not being signed long term. Lawrence is out of reach but we can't say they won't draft a QB high in the draft. I don't think they're in "tank" mode/evaluation mode yet. But the fat lady is starting to sing. It's really a cluster fuck right now.

 

[Doomsday]

Lawrence is out of reach but we can't say they won't draft a QB high in the draft.

Can't say won't or will. In fact won't even say it's necessary, in their minds. Tagging him again will be cheaper with the greatly lowered salary cap that's coming. But one thing I AM sure of - Dak is their guy.

 

[MrB]

It's documented that Jerry didn't hire them. What MM was thinking, there's no idea. But really, this is what you get hiring offensive gurus as head coach - their passion and knowledge isn't on the D side of the ball. They would rather just win games by outscoring people. Not by stopping them. It's a pattern you see all over the league, for decades.

Any at all. "Tanking" doesn't exist. And besides, Dak is their guy. They're not looking at QBs.

Tanking doesn’t exist? According to the dictionary it does.

With the skill positions on this team being so good the best move would have been to hire Eberflus as the HC and then bring in a top level OC. We’re talking about Jerry though.


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[yimyammer]

Over time it surely did. I am sure the first time it did was when Jimmy cut Curvin Richards right after week 17.

IIRC. that was the first one that happened publicly, I read in one of the many books about that era where jeri was pissed Jimmy kept cutting guys without consulting with jeri first and it was getting under his sensitive pansy ass skin but Jimmy had been smart enough to have a contract that gave him absolute power in this regard.

Of course, no coach has had or will ever have that kind of power again. Little miss princess owner is too threatened by other men with a functioning set of Testicles to allow them in the building.

Everyone who becomes head coach of the cowboys will have a whiff of desperation because that's exactly what jeri needs to get them to capitulate to the onerous ham-stringing contract jeri requires them to sign

 

[Doomsday]

Tanking doesn’t exist? According to the dictionary it does.

Yeah, and the definition is more in line with Dodger's description of it, than what you think it is. What you think it is, does not in fact, exist.

 

[Dodger12]

Not at all. But there's a huge difference making wholesale changes to a defensive system when you also already have marginal talent when you start. Normally you can get away with it, this year as Dave said, no.

When we first had this debate, I don't think you mentioned "marginal" talent. You were pretty comfortable blaming the scheme. I guess I feel it's lack of talent and effort first and scheme second, while you think it's scheme first and talent second. Lack of effort has nothing to do with the scheme. Just me though......

 

[Doomsday]

IIRC. that was the first one that happened publicly, I read in one of the many books about that era where jeri was pissed Jimmy kept cutting guys without consulting with jeri first and it was getting under his sensitive pansy ass skin but Jimmy had been smart enough to have a contract that gave him absolute power in this regard.

Some of that was in Jimmy's book too, especially in the second edition. There's always a proverbial straw, and Richards was the straw. It's the only one the league office called them on the carpet for.

 

[Doomsday]

while you think it's scheme first and talent second.

Because with pretty much this same talent, we weren't all-time bad. We weren't breaking league records from the 40s bad.

300 page playbook they already know? Or a 1200 page one they don't know, written in a foreign language? Which one works without a training camp or a preseason?

 

[MrB]

Can't say won't or will. In fact won't even say it's necessary, in their minds. Tagging him again will be cheaper with the greatly lowered salary cap that's coming. But one thing I AM sure of - Dak is their guy.

Tagging Dak will be cheaper than drafting a QB in the 1st round? Did you really just say that?

As I’ve mentioned, there are 2 other QB’s in this draft besides Lawrence. I’m still if the belief that Jerry is not sold on Dak. If he was really sold on him he would already have a contract. He’s never hesitated to sign a guy to a big contract if he really believes in him. As this season goes along though there is a chance that they realize Dak’s value. If that happens and they do resign Dak long term (or tag him again) tanking would help rebuild their defense. Again, as I said earlier, a top 10 pick in each round would greatly help to rebuild the defense.


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[Doomsday]

Tagging Dak will be cheaper than drafting a QB in the 1st round? Did you really just say that?

Sure did not. Context is key.

If he was really sold on him he would already have a contract.

Nonsense. Money wasn't the issue, the checkbook was open. Dak's handlers didn't want a shorter deal than 5 years. It was all about positioning him for the even bigger payday down the road. Getting that one extra bite of the guaranteed moneypie.

 

[Scot]

This right here should be enough to fire Nolan

The last time a defense was this bad was when they were also coached by Nolan

How the fuck can you keep him on staff knowing that

 

[MrB]

Yeah, and the definition is more in line with Dodger's description of it, than what you think it is. What you think it is, does not in fact, exist.

Losing on purpose. Or in Jerry’s case purposely setting his team up to fail. Again you can’t just come out and say “we’re tanking” but as an owner/GM (who is clearly not the best at the GM part) you can make moves that will knowingly cause your team to fail (for draft purposes). I could easily see Jerry doing this, in his demented mind this might be what’s best for the team.


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[Doomsday]

Losing on purpose. Or in Jerry’s case purposely setting his team up to fail. Again you can’t just come out and say “we’re tanking” but as an owner/GM (who is clearly not the best at the GM part) you can make moves that will knowingly cause your team to fail (for draft purposes). I could easily see Jerry doing this, in his demented mind this might be what’s best for the team.

Please give one example of it happening in the NFL. Really. 1989 Cowboys?