superpunk

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If anyone had doubts about the madness that has spread through a large part of the American political spectrum, the reaction to Friday’s better-than expected report from the Bureau of Labor Statistics should have settled the issue. For the immediate response of many on the right — and we’re not just talking fringe figures — was to cry conspiracy.

Leading the charge of what were quickly dubbed the “B.L.S. truthers” was none other than Jack Welch, the former chairman of General Electric, who posted an assertion on Twitter that the books had been cooked to help President Obama’s re-election campaign. His claim was quickly picked up by right-wing pundits and media personalities.

It was nonsense, of course. Job numbers are prepared by professional civil servants, at an agency that currently has no political appointees. But then maybe Mr. Welch — under whose leadership G.E. reported remarkably smooth earnings growth, with none of the short-term fluctuations you might have expected (fluctuations that reappeared under his successor) — doesn’t know how hard it would be to cook the jobs data.

Furthermore, the methods the bureau uses are public — and anyone familiar with the data understands that they are “noisy,” that especially good (or bad) months will be reported now and then as a simple consequence of statistical randomness. And that in turn means that you shouldn’t put much weight on any one month’s report.

In that case, however, what is the somewhat longer-term trend? Is the U.S. employment picture getting better? Yes, it is.

Some background: the monthly employment report is based on two surveys. One asks a random sample of employers how many people are on their payroll. The other asks a random sample of households whether their members are working or looking for work. And if you look at the trend over the past year or so, both surveys suggest a labor market that is gradually on the mend, with job creation consistently exceeding growth in the working-age population.

On the employer side, the current numbers say that over the past year the economy added 150,000 jobs a month, and revisions will probably push that number up significantly. That’s well above the 90,000 or so added jobs per month that we need to keep up with population. (This number used to be higher, but underlying work force growth has dropped off sharply now that many baby boomers are reaching retirement age.)

Meanwhile, the household survey produces estimates of both the number of Americans employed and the number unemployed, defined as people who are seeking work but don’t currently have a job. The eye-popping number from Friday’s report was a sudden drop in the unemployment rate to 7.8 percent from 8.1 percent, but as I said, you shouldn’t put too much emphasis on one month’s number. The more important point is that unemployment has been on a sustained downward trend.

But isn’t that just because people have given up looking for work, and hence no longer count as unemployed? Actually, no. It’s true that the employment-population ratio — the percentage of adults with jobs — has been more or less flat for the past year. But remember those aging baby boomers: the fraction of American adults who are in their prime working years is falling fast. Once you take the effects of an aging population into account, the numbers show a substantial improvement in the employment picture since the summer of 2011.

None of this should be taken to imply that the situation is good, or to deny that we should be doing better — a shortfall largely due to the scorched-earth tactics of Republicans, who have blocked any and all efforts to accelerate the pace of recovery. (If the American Jobs Act, proposed by the Obama administration last year, had been passed, the unemployment rate would probably be below 7 percent.) The U.S. economy is still far short of where it should be, and the job market has a long way to go before it makes up the ground lost in the Great Recession. But the employment data do suggest an economy that is slowly healing, an economy in which declining consumer debt burdens and a housing revival have finally put us on the road back to full employment.

And that’s the truth that the right can’t handle. The furor over Friday’s report revealed a political movement that is rooting for American failure, so obsessed with taking down Mr. Obama that good news for the nation’s long-suffering workers drives its members into a blind rage. It also revealed a movement that lives in an intellectual bubble, dealing with uncomfortable reality — whether that reality involves polls or economic data — not just by denying the facts, but by spinning wild conspiracy theories.

It is, quite simply, frightening to think that a movement this deranged wields so much political power.
 
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The numbers are as bad now as they were when Obama took office. 4 more years? We can only hope it's 4 more weeks.
 

superpunk

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The numbers are as bad now as they were when Obama took office. 4 more years? We can only hope it's 4 more weeks.

That is another dishonest way of looking at it, although it's at least more respectable than the "Obama cooked the books" mantra we've seen from republicans so far.

When Obama took office, the jobless rate was spiralling out of control, nearly doubling in the two years before he took office.

When he took office in 2009, the jobless rate was at 7.8% (which you are right, is where it is now.) However, this doesn't tell the tale of it's meteoric rise - which had to be stopped. 10 months into Obama's term it peaked at 10%, as we continued to feel the effects of policies from his predecessor. Since that time, unemployment has continued to steadily decline, which is the point of this article.

Not only did this administration put a stop to the meteoric rise in unemployment, all statistics point to the recovery being firmly entrenched at this point, as unemploment numbers continue to fall.

http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LNS14000000
 
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Nothing dishonest about it. It's the same now as 4 years ago. And if I recall much of Obama's campaign then was about hope and change due to the horrible economic and unemployment situation. 4 years later, it's at the same point.
 

superpunk

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Just summarized what you just said.

I go through the trouble to say it's dishonest, and here is EXACTLY why, and your response is "nuh-uh it's not dishonest"?

ok brohame, we've introduced as fact that the jobless rate is exactly the same as when Obama took office, I have no problem with that. How about the rest of it or do you not want to talk about the good direction this country seems to be heading in from a jobs-growth perspective? I know I wouldn't if I were you.
When he took office in 2009, the jobless rate was at 7.8% (which you are right, is where it is now.) However, this doesn't tell the tale of it's meteoric rise - which had to be stopped. 10 months into Obama's term it peaked at 10%, as we continued to feel the effects of policies from his predecessor. Since that time, unemployment has continued to steadily decline, which is the point of this article.

Not only did this administration put a stop to the meteoric rise in unemployment, all statistics point to the recovery being firmly entrenched at this point, as unemploment numbers continue to fall.

Feel free to spin that however you see fit.
 

jeebus

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Unemployment keeps falling, but with no corresponding rise in jobs. It is not a conspiracy, just our derivative numbers are worthless because we are dealing with a once in a century jobs collapse.
 
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I go through the trouble to say it's dishonest, and here is EXACTLY why, and your response is "nuh-uh it's not dishonest"?

ok brohame, we've introduced as fact that the jobless rate is exactly the same as when Obama took office, I have no problem with that. How about the rest of it or do you not want to talk about the good direction this country seems to be heading in from a jobs-growth perspective? I know I wouldn't if I were you.


Feel free to spin that however you see fit.

Seems to be heading? Really? For all we know this is an aberration and it's going to go back in the other direction or just level off.

Four years ago Obama campaigned and ranted about how horrible things were under Bush and then when he got in office things actually got worse. Now after all of his promises and stimulus', instead of unemployment being at 5.6% like he said it would be at this time it is in fact 7.8%, which is exactly where we started at. You know, the point at which it was so horrible to begin with.

So please continue with your spin. It's quite humorous how 7.8% was horrible four years ago yet is now a sign of things turning around lol
 

superpunk

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Seems to be heading? Really? For all we know this is an aberration and it's going to go back in the other direction or just level off.

Four years ago Obama campaigned and ranted about how horrible things were under Bush and then when he got in office things actually got worse. Now after all of his promises and stimulus', instead of unemployment being at 5.6% like he said it would be at this time it is in fact 7.8%, which is exactly where we started at. You know, the point at which it was so horrible to begin with.

So please continue with your spin. It's quite humorous how 7.8% was horrible four years ago yet is now a sign of things turning around lol
It could level off or get worse. It could also drop to 0 tomorrow but none of that is exactly worth talking about is it? Right now the trend has been consistently good for two years.

I've already bitch slapped you on the rest of your nonsense no need to do it again.
 
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It could level off or get worse. It could also drop to 0 tomorrow but none of that is exactly worth talking about is it? Right now the trend has been consistently good for two years.

I've already bitch slapped you on the rest of your nonsense no need to do it again.

lol Consistently good

No, it's been over 8% for most of that time and now, one month it dropped to 7.8% which is where it was 4 years ago.

What about the promise he made to have it down to 5.6% after the stimulus? Guess you want to side step that, huh?
 

dbair1967

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It could level off or get worse. It could also drop to 0 tomorrow but none of that is exactly worth talking about is it? Right now the trend has been consistently good for two years.

I've already bitch slapped you on the rest of your nonsense no need to do it again.

real unemployment (and underemployed) closer to 15%, O promised something around 5 1/2 or so if we passed his ridiculous stimulus

deficit at 16 trillion, something O promised would be half what it was when he took office, instead he drove it up ant a record pace

47 million on food stamps

100's of billions in tax payer dollars wasted on retarded green energy companies who are mostly run by Obama croanies

Massive foreign policy failure, culminating recently with outright coverup/lie in Libya

Yep. Winning
 

dbair1967

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lol Consistently good

No, it's been over 8% for most of that time and now, one month it dropped to 7.8% which is where it was 4 years ago.

?

And its really not even 7.8%, thats the number O and his people made up by falsifying numbers. Sounds like alot of his own economic people dont even believe the number.
 
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And its really not even 7.8%, thats the number O and his people made up by falsifying numbers. Sounds like alot of his own economic people dont even believe the number.

Does sound fishy to get below 8% for the first time just one month before the election. But even giving it the benefit of the doubt, it's still as bad as it was when he took office. Now suddenly it's supposed to be a major positive. Get real.
 

NoDak

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Imagine yourself being punched in the face. That's bad. Then you start getting your head stomped on for awhile. When they get tired and just start punching you in the face again, that's good.


YAY 7.8%!! :towel
 

superpunk

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lol Consistently good

No, it's been over 8% for most of that time and now, one month it dropped to 7.8% which is where it was 4 years ago.

What about the promise he made to have it down to 5.6% after the stimulus? Guess you want to side step that, huh?
see post 3 in this thread.
 
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