The never-ending POTUS Election thread....

[Midswat]

Any Black men on this website? How do you(Black peeps) feel about the way this country has bent themselves over for illegal immigrants, basically giving to them what, imo, they owe to black people because of this little thing called "slavery"?

Troll post?

 

[ThoughtExperiment]

These young kids that are all anti-American are in for a rude awakening. At some point, they'll have to fend for themselves. They'll learn very quickly that they won't be entitled to the same things that other folks are by nature of their nationality, ethnicity and illegal status among other things. As they get older, they won't be part of the voting block that Dems are targeting.

I hope you're right, but something seems different among the millenials. It seems more pervasive and more hardcore than just youthful idealism that most people go through.

 

[dbair1967]

I've heard of exactly two of those people on that list before your post here. And I work in the profession.

I'm sure random dbair Cowboy homer on DCU has not only heard of all of them before, but knows what their opinions are on the rule of law and Constitutional theory.

I haven't heard of them all, a few names I have seen mentioned though over and over as potential SC candidates.

It surprises me you say you've only heard of two. Perhaps that's because you prefer more liberal leaning justices and only keep up with them.

 

[dbair1967]

No shit I question your vetting of them... I question whether you've ever heard of the guys before Trump identified them as potential candidates for nomination. And magically, when he lists them, you fall right in line.

Again with this bullshit?

What I said and what you said are two different things. I said you voted for Obama twice (which I believe you admitted here previously) and apparently didn't have any problem with him circumventing the constitution over and over, and yet you ridicule another candidate for potentially doing that (even though there's zero evidence he would do anything like that).

If you are admitting Obama isn't a good President, at least that's one thing we agree on.

 

[dbair1967]

All of this country's problems come from illegal immigration? Really, all of them? How can you say that, Sheik?

I wouldn't say all, but there's a ton of problems with it and making it even easier for more to come here or granting all those that came here illegally amnesty sure as hell doesn't fix shit.

 

[dbair1967]

And yet gave you two all-time record tax increases, tripled the size and scope of Government,.

Pretty sure one of the first things Reagan did was dramatically slash income tax rates from the ridiculous levels they had reached under Carter. I believe the actual numbers are 70% for what was the top tax bracket to his 28%, I believe this was his 2nd major tax cut.

Here's some other info:

http://www.heritage.org/research/commentary/2015/7/reagans-tax-cutting-legacy

 

[dbair1967]

These young kids that are all anti-American are in for a rude awakening. At some point, they'll have to fend for themselves. They'll learn very quickly that they won't be entitled to the same things that other folks are by nature of their nationality, ethnicity and illegal status among other things. As they get older, they won't be part of the voting block that Dems are targeting.

.

I actually don't think they will. The more they feel entitled to something and the more dependent on government they are, the less likely it is they'll acknowledge its vastly flawed and actually do something about it. Look at Europe.

It may not happen in my lifetime or even my son's lifetime, but I firmly believe at some point in the next 100-200 years there's going to be another major Revolution or Civil War in our country. This country has gone down the shitter in record time under this clown Obama, although he himself wasn't the originator of this. The leftist people got together long ago and formulated how to ruin this country and have been acting on it for decades. Small steps at a time to build dependence on the government and the belief that government can fix everything. Obama just took it to brand new levels, which he did promise he was going to do when he got elected.

 

[jnday]

I actually don't think they will. The more they feel entitled to something and the more dependent on government they are, the less likely it is they'll acknowledge its vastly flawed and actually do something about it. Look at Europe.

It may not happen in my lifetime or even my son's lifetime, but I firmly believe at some point in the next 100-200 years there's going to be another major Revolution or Civil War in our country. This country has gone down the shitter in record time under this clown Obama, although he himself wasn't the originator of this. The leftist people got together long ago and formulated how to ruin this country and have been acting on it for decades. Small steps at a time to build dependence on the government and the belief that government can fix everything. Obama just took it to brand new levels, which he did promise he was going to do when he got elected.

There will be a civil war sooner rather than later. I think that home grown terror attacks will start soon. The political divide in too deep for reconciliation . The USA is not the country that I grew up in. I don't know what you should call this current country. The ideals our our Founding Fathers has been trampled on to the point that they don't exist. A veteran of WW2 and the Korean War told me that he would have never served in the armed forces if he knew this country would turn out like this. I understand completely why he said that and it is sad that many veterans feel this way. People are feed up with the liberal foolishness.

 

[Doomsday]

Pretty sure one of the first things Reagan did was dramatically slash income tax rates from the ridiculous levels they had reached under Carter. I believe the actual numbers are 70% for what was the top tax bracket to his 28%, I believe this was his 2nd major tax cut.

Right, 1981. But then in '83 and '86 signed into law the two biggest tax increases in history, as I said. All told, the tax increases Reagan approved ended up canceling out ALL of the reduction in tax revenue that resulted from his 1981 legislation. He raised taxes, tripled the size and scope of the federal government, and exploded the deficit. That's merely historical fact.

And jnday - I appreciate your views and opinion. All I am saying - and I think you must agree - is that Trump has a LOT of work to do because now, for the general election, he must win MINDS not just hearts.

 

[peplaw06]

Poor choice of words.

I can list what I believe Illegal immigration effects.

1. In california alone, it's estimated that the underground economy is in excess of $100 billion yearly. That's untaxed income, lots of that money goes back to Mexico.

2. It burdens our schools and social programs that are meant to be in place for American citizens. When an illegal shits out a baby, that baby is now our problem, tax payers problem.

3. In most cases, illegals are not coming in here and assimilating to our culture, they are bringing theirs. Sad but true, but in a lot of cultures, incest, honor killings, gang rape. Who knows how many Americans are subject to those violent activities? Would anyone argue that one case is too many?

4. National Security. When people can come here on VISAS and have them expire, and there's no way to really track that person, and said person ends up blowing up a nursery full of children, or shooting up a church etc, I'd argue that our immigration policies are broken.

Immigration should benefit the people of this country, not burden us. There should be a higher standard in place that ensures that every immigrant that arrives here is instantly a productive citizen.

That's my opinion. I apologize for making such a matter of fact statement.

All of these issues can be fixed in ways that don't include deporting 11,000,000 people. Grant a legal path to citizenship quickly. Require them to pay taxes and follow laws, just like the rest of us. Trying to round them all up and boot them out not only is next to impossible, it is only going to make them despise us more. The rhetoric coming from the right is turning them all into Democrats. If we welcome them with open arms, they will be more likely to assimilate, it helps the economy, and the currently heavy burden on the taxpayers is shared among the new citizens.

Now, if you we're talking about the bloated size of the social safety net, then we will probably be in agreement there. I'm in favor of shrinking the budget for welfare programs, not to mention a ton of other government agencies. Fiscally conservative, free market, live and let live... that's basically my political MO in a nutshell.

 

[peplaw06]

I haven't heard of them all, a few names I have seen mentioned though over and over as potential SC candidates.

So what's impressive about them then?

It surprises me you say you've only heard of two. Perhaps that's because you prefer more liberal leaning justices and only keep up with them.

No, it's because I've got more important shit to do than speculate what judges around the country might be nominated to SCOTUS and research their resumes.

 

[peplaw06]

What I said and what you said are two different things. I said you voted for Obama twice

Wrong.

(which I believe you admitted here previously)

Wrong.

and apparently didn't have any problem with him circumventing the constitution over and over,

Wrong.

and yet you ridicule another candidate for potentially doing that

Yes.

(even though there's zero evidence he would do anything like that).

Bullshit there's not... The guy has claimed he's going to "open up the libel laws." That's a direct attack on the first amendment.

 

[junk]

I don't really have a strong opinion on immigration. I guess, in general, I'm not opposed to immigration. Generally, I would think, more people, more demand for goods and services, etc. would drive the economy forward. And, this will sound bad, but immigrants are willing to do a lot of the shit jobs that most Americans don't do anymore.

I've only just started researching it because I was curious what the cost to taxpayers was for illegal immigration.

This was an interesting link.

5 immigration myths debunked - Nov. 20, 2014

A few interesting points in the article:

A 2013 CBO analysis of the failed bipartisan bill introduced by the so-called "gang of 8" that would have created a path to legal status for many undocumented immigrants found that increasing legal immigration would increase government spending on refundable tax credits, Medicaid and health insurance subsidies, among other federal benefits. But it would also create even more tax revenue by way of income and payroll taxes. That could reduce deficits by $175 billion over the first 10 years and by at least $700 billion in the second decade.

"They are paying an estimated $15 billion a year into Social Security with no intention of ever collecting benefits," Stephen Goss, chief actuary of the SSA told CNNMoney. "Without the estimated 3.1 million undocumented immigrants paying into the system, Social Security would have entered persistent shortfall of tax revenue to cover payouts starting in 2009," he said.

As the baby boom generation ages and retires, immigrant workers are key to shoring up Social Security and counteracting the effects of the decline in U.S.-born workers paying into the system, Goss said.

Without immigrants, the Social Security Board of Trustees projects that the system will no longer be able to pay the full promised benefits by 2037.

Undocumented immigrants do not qualify for welfare, food stamps, Medicaid, and most other public benefits. Most of these programs require proof of legal immigration status and under the 1996 welfare law, even legal immigrants cannot receive these benefits until they have been in the United States for more than five years.

A CBO report on the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act of 2007 concluded that a path to legalization for immigrants would increase federal revenues by $48 billion. Such a plan would see $23 billion in increased costs from the use of public services, but ultimately, it would produce a surplus of $25 billion for government coffers, CBO said.

 

[dbair1967]

Right, 1981. But then in '83 and '86 signed into law the two biggest tax increases in history, as I said. .

Did you even read the story? It was his 2nd tax cut that lowered the level to 28%

 

[dbair1967]

So what's impressive about them then?

They're all people liberals probably don't like, which in my book makes them awesome. (sarcasm before you reply with some bonehead stuff)

No, it's because I've got more important shit to do than speculate what judges around the country might be nominated to SCOTUS and research their resumes.

As the DCU resident legal expert, you should be doing just that

 

[Doomsday]

Did you even read the story? It was his 2nd tax cut that lowered the level to 28%

None of it changes the fact that in '83 and '86 he signed the two biggest tax increases in history. All told, the tax increases Reagan approved ended up canceling out ALL of the reduction in tax revenue that resulted from his 1981 legislation. He raised taxes, tripled the size and scope of the federal government, and exploded the deficit. That's merely historical fact.

Not my fault you choose to ignore it.

I also explained why he did what he did. In order to spend the Soviet Union into oblivion, he had to get his democrat-controlled congress on board. Only way to do that was to give them the tax increases they wanted, and to pass their massive regulations and creation of new entitlements, new departments and bureaucracies, everything he was against. It was a co-dependency relationship and the reality of Washington at the time.

 

[dbair1967]

None of it changes the fact that in '83 and '86 he signed the two biggest tax increases in history.

Lets see some specifics then. I don't see how any tax "increases" that passed would have completely offset cutting the Income Tax rates for all, including the top bracket going from 70% to 28%.

All told, the tax increases Reagan approved ended up canceling out ALL of the reduction in tax revenue that resulted from his 1981 legislation. He raised taxes, tripled the size and scope of the federal government, and exploded the deficit. That's merely historical fact.

Looks like a "doomsday" historical fact and probably pretty far from the actual truth.

Again if you are so sure about it, post some specifics that support it. When I Google "Reagan tax increases" your version of history doesn't seem to be there. There's plenty of stuff about some of the taxes he did raise, but not what you are throwing out there.

Not my fault you choose to ignore it.

I'm not ignoring, but am questioning it.

I also explained why he did what he did. In order to spend the Soviet Union into oblivion, he had to get his democrat-controlled congress on board. Only way to do that was to give them the tax increases they wanted, and to pass their massive regulations and creation of new entitlements, new departments and bureaucracies, everything he was against. It was a co-dependency relationship and the reality of Washington at the time.

Yeah again, lets see some sources for this. Not the "doomsday" I said it so its true source.

 

[Dodger12]

I hope you're right, but something seems different among the millenials. It seems more pervasive and more hardcore than just youthful idealism that most people go through.

It's different because it's more visual with the advent of social media. Young people have been protesting for some time now, probably starting in the 60's with the civil rights movement and opposition to the Vietnam War.

But I do agree it's different in the sense that, at least to me anyway, the future for these kids is bleak. Our kids have been brainwashed and indoctrinated at an early age in school and that carried over when they attended liberal universities. I have three teenage kids, one of which is in college. We talk politics all the time and it's amazing some of things their teachers "teach" them. These kids will pay for this "free" bullshit sooner or later.....

 

[Dodger12]

All of these issues can be fixed in ways that don't include deporting 11,000,000 people. Grant a legal path to citizenship quickly. Require them to pay taxes and follow laws, just like the rest of us.

Not sure why anyone born in this country would be so quick to offer up citizenship to so many illegal aliens. If these folks want to come here and work, offer them a path to legalization (ie: work visas). They'd pay taxes and the end result would be the same as your option, except they don't get citizenship.

 

[peplaw06]

Not sure why anyone born in this country would be so quick to offer up citizenship to so many illegal aliens. If these folks want to come here and work, offer them a path to legalization (ie: work visas). They'd pay taxes and the end result would be the same as your option, except they don't get citizenship.

If the work visas expire then that doesn't fix the problem. If you don't have a problem with them being here, why do you have a problem with them being citizens?