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It's Hard to Play the F-Back: Wes Bunting Talks Nose Tackles & Fullbacks
Posted by Rafael at Wednesday, August 31, 2011
In part two of this week's chat, the National Football Post's Wes Bunting offers a top nose tackle prospect, blocking tight end prospects, and describes why it is so hard to project running backs and tight ends to play fullback in the NFL.
Cowboys Nation: We discussed defense ends in our last chat, and you had good things to say about Alabama's Josh Chapman back in May when you were starting your reports. Have you seen any other senior nose tackles who stood out to you?
Wes Bunting: One guy I really like is Washington's Alameda Ta'amu. He's a 6'3'', 330 lb. kid with a good first step. He can stay low and he's a bear to move off the ball. He's not real sudden as a pass rusher, but this guy can anchor a 3-4 front without a doubt. He's a strong kid. He's got a little Haloti Ngata to him. I wouldn't say he's quite the athlete Ngata is. He's not as sudden as a pass rusher. But as a linear player who can overpower opponents, he's an impressive anchor to a 3-4.
CN: Martellus Bennett is entering the walk-year of his contract. He's gotten bigger and he's improved as a blocker, but at the end of the day he's still backing up Jason Witten. Are there any big tight ends in the Bennett mold, guys who project in the 3rd to the 5th or 6th rounds who impressed you?
WB: You want pass catchers, or do it all types?
CN: More blocking, do-it-all types.
WB: Start with North Carolina State's George Bryan. He's a 6'4", 265 lb. guy. He doesn't run very well. He looks more like a 4.8 guy speed with, but he can play in tight areas and he gets after it as a blocker. I think he can be a good number 2 tight end on a team and be a solid complementary player to Jason Witten. He's kind of the anti-Martellus Bennett. He's not the most talented guy, but he gets the most out of his talent. He wants to get after it. He wants to be a good football player.
Blake Ayles from Miami also fits the profile. He's a transfer from USC. He's another big kid 6'5'', 265. He's a real coordinated pass catcher. He adjusts to the ball well. He's not gonna run away from you in man coverage, but like Bryan, he gets after it in the run game.
These are two guys that I like who are better blockers than receivers, who have a chance to be in the NFL.
CN: Bennett has irritated a lot of fans with his immaturity. He's also still dropping passes, which can drive you crazy. But he's improved as a blocker and he's important to their goal-line and short-yardage offenses, and the Cowboys need to find somebody to replace his skill set. They drafted Shaun Chapas, but he's not a certain hit. I think he's one of the final keep-or-cut decisions.
He and Chris Gronkowski look very similar, and the coaches have been experimenting moving linebackers to fullback. They're not satisfied with what they have. They want somebody who catch the ball and who can move linebackers on inside runs. Is there anybody in the college game, in the senior class, who fits this description?
WB: It's not a great fullback class. I've seen Chad Diehl, from Clemson and he's one of the highest rated fullbacks, and I wasn't overly impressed with him. He's a big, strong kid, 6'2", 260 lbs. but he doesn't that that real snap that I like to see in fullbacks.
Devon Ramsay from North Carolina is a good pass catcher and a powerful kid. He gets a bit upright and he's a good enough athlete. With some better coaching and lower can more consistent pad level could be a potential NFL starter. He's probably the best senior fullback I've seen this year and right now I'd give him a low-round grade, but I'd feel better getting him as a free agent, to be honest.
CN: Let me twist the question a bit. The best success they've had at fullback has been moving tight ends into F-backs. They've used Witten this way, when they've had a good tight end to put on the line, and they're using John Phillips this way. Phillips is probably their best fullback right now. He's the third tight end and they flex him into the backfield a lot. He can move linebackers.
Can you name any college fullbacks who can project to the fullback position?
WB: You need these shorter guys who can gain leverage a little better. That's what makes it so tough to find them. Anthony Miller from Cal is a 6'3", 260 lb. player who is powerful. I think he could find that mold. Jake Bryne from Wisconsin (6'4", 260.) is another powerful kid who has the mental makeup to play that role, but I think he might struggle with leverage.
I would take a look at the Miller kid from Cal. I don't know if he's draftable. He's probably 6'2" and a half. He's got some thump, and he intrigued me enough on tape to think he might be able to do that.
CN: Say more about the difficulty in projecting and converting guys to fullback. You're mentioned leverage. are the prospects too tall?
WB: You look at the tight end position, and even at the college level you want guys 6'4'', 6'5'', and they need to be big enough to engage ends, and long enough to avoid linebackers, when they get out of their stance and try to release up the field.
Now, you try to move them into the backfield and try them as lead blockers, they're facing 6'2'', 6'1'' squatty inside linebackers who have natural leverage. If they can get under these taller guys they can stone them on contact. When you try and move a tight end in the backfield you have to look at his physical skill set first and if they're not 6'3'' or shorter, I think you're too tall. They have to be unique athletes to fit the role.
CN: And with so many colleges running spread offenses, teams don't have much use for traditional fullbacks.
WB: No, if you can catch and can run some, you're turned into an H-back or split wide as a slot back.
CN: The Cowboys have tried this with all types of players the last five years. They did it with Oliver Hoyte, back in '06. He was an inside backer at N.C. State and he was their starting fullback for a year and a half. I'm not going to ask you to project inside backers to fullback. That's too much of a curveball, but can you see any big running backs making that move?
WB: That's another tough one as well, because you've got these running backs who have been told their entire careers, be the guy, make the man miss, you get the stats, you get the attention. And now you've got to be the guy who helps the other running back get the stats. That's all about mental makeup.
I'd look at Ryan Houston from North Carolina. He's got the size at 6'2'', 245. He's got a little burst, but he doesn't have that big-time speed to make me think he'll be an NFL running back. Physically, I think he can do the job.
CN: Can he catch?
WB: He can catch. He's coordinated. But it takes a unique athlete to want to change up and start driving people off the football. It's all mental, and that makes it hard to try and project who wants to make that change.
Next: Wes wraps up the fullback discussion and we talk quarterbacks.
Posted by Rafael at Wednesday, August 31, 2011
In part two of this week's chat, the National Football Post's Wes Bunting offers a top nose tackle prospect, blocking tight end prospects, and describes why it is so hard to project running backs and tight ends to play fullback in the NFL.
Cowboys Nation: We discussed defense ends in our last chat, and you had good things to say about Alabama's Josh Chapman back in May when you were starting your reports. Have you seen any other senior nose tackles who stood out to you?
Wes Bunting: One guy I really like is Washington's Alameda Ta'amu. He's a 6'3'', 330 lb. kid with a good first step. He can stay low and he's a bear to move off the ball. He's not real sudden as a pass rusher, but this guy can anchor a 3-4 front without a doubt. He's a strong kid. He's got a little Haloti Ngata to him. I wouldn't say he's quite the athlete Ngata is. He's not as sudden as a pass rusher. But as a linear player who can overpower opponents, he's an impressive anchor to a 3-4.
CN: Martellus Bennett is entering the walk-year of his contract. He's gotten bigger and he's improved as a blocker, but at the end of the day he's still backing up Jason Witten. Are there any big tight ends in the Bennett mold, guys who project in the 3rd to the 5th or 6th rounds who impressed you?
WB: You want pass catchers, or do it all types?
CN: More blocking, do-it-all types.
WB: Start with North Carolina State's George Bryan. He's a 6'4", 265 lb. guy. He doesn't run very well. He looks more like a 4.8 guy speed with, but he can play in tight areas and he gets after it as a blocker. I think he can be a good number 2 tight end on a team and be a solid complementary player to Jason Witten. He's kind of the anti-Martellus Bennett. He's not the most talented guy, but he gets the most out of his talent. He wants to get after it. He wants to be a good football player.
Blake Ayles from Miami also fits the profile. He's a transfer from USC. He's another big kid 6'5'', 265. He's a real coordinated pass catcher. He adjusts to the ball well. He's not gonna run away from you in man coverage, but like Bryan, he gets after it in the run game.
These are two guys that I like who are better blockers than receivers, who have a chance to be in the NFL.
CN: Bennett has irritated a lot of fans with his immaturity. He's also still dropping passes, which can drive you crazy. But he's improved as a blocker and he's important to their goal-line and short-yardage offenses, and the Cowboys need to find somebody to replace his skill set. They drafted Shaun Chapas, but he's not a certain hit. I think he's one of the final keep-or-cut decisions.
He and Chris Gronkowski look very similar, and the coaches have been experimenting moving linebackers to fullback. They're not satisfied with what they have. They want somebody who catch the ball and who can move linebackers on inside runs. Is there anybody in the college game, in the senior class, who fits this description?
WB: It's not a great fullback class. I've seen Chad Diehl, from Clemson and he's one of the highest rated fullbacks, and I wasn't overly impressed with him. He's a big, strong kid, 6'2", 260 lbs. but he doesn't that that real snap that I like to see in fullbacks.
Devon Ramsay from North Carolina is a good pass catcher and a powerful kid. He gets a bit upright and he's a good enough athlete. With some better coaching and lower can more consistent pad level could be a potential NFL starter. He's probably the best senior fullback I've seen this year and right now I'd give him a low-round grade, but I'd feel better getting him as a free agent, to be honest.
CN: Let me twist the question a bit. The best success they've had at fullback has been moving tight ends into F-backs. They've used Witten this way, when they've had a good tight end to put on the line, and they're using John Phillips this way. Phillips is probably their best fullback right now. He's the third tight end and they flex him into the backfield a lot. He can move linebackers.
Can you name any college fullbacks who can project to the fullback position?
WB: You need these shorter guys who can gain leverage a little better. That's what makes it so tough to find them. Anthony Miller from Cal is a 6'3", 260 lb. player who is powerful. I think he could find that mold. Jake Bryne from Wisconsin (6'4", 260.) is another powerful kid who has the mental makeup to play that role, but I think he might struggle with leverage.
I would take a look at the Miller kid from Cal. I don't know if he's draftable. He's probably 6'2" and a half. He's got some thump, and he intrigued me enough on tape to think he might be able to do that.
CN: Say more about the difficulty in projecting and converting guys to fullback. You're mentioned leverage. are the prospects too tall?
WB: You look at the tight end position, and even at the college level you want guys 6'4'', 6'5'', and they need to be big enough to engage ends, and long enough to avoid linebackers, when they get out of their stance and try to release up the field.
Now, you try to move them into the backfield and try them as lead blockers, they're facing 6'2'', 6'1'' squatty inside linebackers who have natural leverage. If they can get under these taller guys they can stone them on contact. When you try and move a tight end in the backfield you have to look at his physical skill set first and if they're not 6'3'' or shorter, I think you're too tall. They have to be unique athletes to fit the role.
CN: And with so many colleges running spread offenses, teams don't have much use for traditional fullbacks.
WB: No, if you can catch and can run some, you're turned into an H-back or split wide as a slot back.
CN: The Cowboys have tried this with all types of players the last five years. They did it with Oliver Hoyte, back in '06. He was an inside backer at N.C. State and he was their starting fullback for a year and a half. I'm not going to ask you to project inside backers to fullback. That's too much of a curveball, but can you see any big running backs making that move?
WB: That's another tough one as well, because you've got these running backs who have been told their entire careers, be the guy, make the man miss, you get the stats, you get the attention. And now you've got to be the guy who helps the other running back get the stats. That's all about mental makeup.
I'd look at Ryan Houston from North Carolina. He's got the size at 6'2'', 245. He's got a little burst, but he doesn't have that big-time speed to make me think he'll be an NFL running back. Physically, I think he can do the job.
CN: Can he catch?
WB: He can catch. He's coordinated. But it takes a unique athlete to want to change up and start driving people off the football. It's all mental, and that makes it hard to try and project who wants to make that change.
Next: Wes wraps up the fullback discussion and we talk quarterbacks.